Comments on: Why does it matter if we call it journalism? http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/ A conversation. Wed, 23 May 2012 15:16:23 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Glyn http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3365 Glyn Wed, 14 Nov 2007 10:46:11 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3365 I think teachj has hit a nail on the head here, the old school’s fear is that someone untrained/inexperienced will be putting out defamatory content. But surely it was ever thus. This question of accuracy is crucial, pros have it drummed into them – but don’t always get it right. So why should CJs be any different? The key is expertise as Bas says, someone with it will always get respect. The question isn't about how to name pro/am journalism (although I now want a "Je suis un contentuer" T-shirt) - but about the consumer and how they choose to access the good work being done on either side of this “divide”. No one doubts citizen journalists are covering stories the pros couldn't get near. And there’s no doubt that excellent pro journalism is being done. It comes down to where people want to consume their news. And for a while, at least, trusted brands will still be the order of the day. I think teachj has hit a nail on the head here, the old school’s fear is that someone untrained/inexperienced will be putting out defamatory content.

But surely it was ever thus. This question of accuracy is crucial, pros have it drummed into them – but don’t always get it right. So why should CJs be any different?

The key is expertise as Bas says, someone with it will always get respect.

The question isn’t about how to name pro/am journalism (although I now want a “Je suis un contentuer” T-shirt) – but about the consumer and how they choose to access the good work being done on either side of this “divide”.

No one doubts citizen journalists are covering stories the pros couldn’t get near. And there’s no doubt that excellent pro journalism is being done.

It comes down to where people want to consume their news. And for a while, at least, trusted brands will still be the order of the day.

]]> By: Andy Williams http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3364 Andy Williams Mon, 12 Nov 2007 12:26:30 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3364 A quick response to Dave's post 6: http://www.yougov.com/archives/pdf/TEL020101018_2.pdf That's a link to a YouGov poll on trust which grades the public's trust in different flavours of journalist (amongst other professions). Interestingly, ITV and Channel 4 journalists come out on top, with BBC journalists a close second. Tabloid reporters come bottom, of course. A quick response to Dave’s post 6:
http://www.yougov.com/archives/pdf/TEL020101018_2.pdf
That’s a link to a YouGov poll on trust which grades the public’s trust in different flavours of journalist (amongst other professions). Interestingly, ITV and Channel 4 journalists come out on top, with BBC journalists a close second. Tabloid reporters come bottom, of course.

]]> By: paulbradshaw http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3363 paulbradshaw Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:06:15 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3363 I love 'Contenteurs'! I've actually been a bit arch with this post, because I do have my own opinions on the question. The main reason I can think of it being important why we call it journalism is about access, and legal protection. Scott Gant's book (http://astore.amazon.co.uk/onlijourblog-21/detail/0743299264/026-5719578-6981262) does a good job of covering those issues, and why we need to rethink the privileges afforded professional journalists vs citizens. I love ‘Contenteurs’!
I’ve actually been a bit arch with this post, because I do have my own opinions on the question. The main reason I can think of it being important why we call it journalism is about access, and legal protection. Scott Gant’s book (http://astore.amazon.co.uk/onlijourblog-21/detail/0743299264/026-5719578-6981262) does a good job of covering those issues, and why we need to rethink the privileges afforded professional journalists vs citizens.

]]> By: Craig Stoltz http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3353 Craig Stoltz Mon, 12 Nov 2007 02:44:23 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3353 The term "citizen journalist" has always puzzled me. As opposed to what, "illegal alien journalists"? No, seriously, folks: The difficulty lies in the fact that as the media by which people deliver "content" multiply, so do the number, and kinds, of people who create it. Blog axe-grinders certainly are not reporters. Editorialists, perhaps. When MSM reporters point to other web content they curate rather than report. When flash developers illuminate something, they are doing news analysis. When citizen journalists uncover a microscam, they are doing investigative reporting. When a gal with a cell phone posts videos of a celeb perp walk on YouTube, she's. . ..what, a videographer? A gossip reporter? My point is we're trying to come up with one term to describe many different things done by many different kinds of people who have many different agendas. All right, it sounds arch and European, but: Contenteurs? The term “citizen journalist” has always puzzled me. As opposed to what, “illegal alien journalists”?

No, seriously, folks: The difficulty lies in the fact that as the media by which people deliver “content” multiply, so do the number, and kinds, of people who create it.

Blog axe-grinders certainly are not reporters. Editorialists, perhaps.

When MSM reporters point to other web content they curate rather than report.

When flash developers illuminate something, they are doing news analysis.

When citizen journalists uncover a microscam, they are doing investigative reporting.

When a gal with a cell phone posts videos of a celeb perp walk on YouTube, she’s. . ..what, a videographer? A gossip reporter?

My point is we’re trying to come up with one term to describe many different things done by many different kinds of people who have many different agendas.

All right, it sounds arch and European, but: Contenteurs?

]]> By:   links for 2007-11-11 by andydickinson.net http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3362   links for 2007-11-11 by andydickinson.net Sun, 11 Nov 2007 23:30:01 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3362 [...] Why does it matter if we call it journalism? « Online Journalism Blog “It amazes me that people are still debating whether X or Y is journalism. Apart from anything else, it seems such a pointless debate. Why does it matter what you call it?” (tags: journalism) [...] [...] Why does it matter if we call it journalism? « Online Journalism Blog “It amazes me that people are still debating whether X or Y is journalism. Apart from anything else, it seems such a pointless debate. Why does it matter what you call it?” (tags: journalism) [...]

]]> By: teachj http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3352 teachj Sat, 10 Nov 2007 01:23:46 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3352 I deal with this kind of prejudice all the time as a high school teacher. My students get labeled as "not real journalists" simply because they are young and just learning their trade. But there is not certification board (at least in the US) for journalists. Journalism is a craft, just like painting, glass blowing or metal working. You can do it professionally (with various degrees of success) or as an amateur (also with various degrees of success). More than 200 years ago a free press meant you owned one, today it means you own a laptop with internet access. Journalists are running scared because they are worried that the money stream that has fed their business for more than a century is running out. But I think someone will always be willing to sponsor good local news. National and international news will get covered by the googles and yahoos of the future. Chill out. I deal with this kind of prejudice all the time as a high school teacher. My students get labeled as “not real journalists” simply because they are young and just learning their trade. But there is not certification board (at least in the US) for journalists.

Journalism is a craft, just like painting, glass blowing or metal working. You can do it professionally (with various degrees of success) or as an amateur (also with various degrees of success). More than 200 years ago a free press meant you owned one, today it means you own a laptop with internet access.

Journalists are running scared because they are worried that the money stream that has fed their business for more than a century is running out.

But I think someone will always be willing to sponsor good local news. National and international news will get covered by the googles and yahoos of the future.

Chill out.

]]> By: Dr John Cokley http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3354 Dr John Cokley Fri, 09 Nov 2007 23:01:10 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3354 I think it does matter but unlike many, I am ready to acknowledge citizen journalists as my colleagues ... who are also my competitors. I think the last point is essential. Journalists routinely drink and natter professionally with their colleagues who work for competing enterprises ... half the pubs in the world would close if this was not so. Some of my competitors don't have the collected experience, skills or education which I do, but still work and earn a living quite well. And I don't have the collected experience, skills or education of some others i drink with and work with, but they still deal with -- and talk to -- me. this debate chews at a nagging wound in journalism ... it's called insularity and insecurity. in my work, i try to help newcomers to journalism acquire knowledge, skills and attitudes which will allow them to function in the world of journalism ... thus forming them as journalists. i don't equivocate about this ... i aim to form journalists, no matter where or for whom they work. god knows, i've worked for just about the whole spectrum, including myself. and no one has ever suggested that i am not a journalist. I think it does matter but unlike many, I am ready to acknowledge citizen journalists as my colleagues … who are also my competitors. I think the last point is essential. Journalists routinely drink and natter professionally with their colleagues who work for competing enterprises … half the pubs in the world would close if this was not so. Some of my competitors don’t have the collected experience, skills or education which I do, but still work and earn a living quite well. And I don’t have the collected experience, skills or education of some others i drink with and work with, but they still deal with — and talk to — me. this debate chews at a nagging wound in journalism … it’s called insularity and insecurity. in my work, i try to help newcomers to journalism acquire knowledge, skills and attitudes which will allow them to function in the world of journalism … thus forming them as journalists. i don’t equivocate about this … i aim to form journalists, no matter where or for whom they work. god knows, i’ve worked for just about the whole spectrum, including myself. and no one has ever suggested that i am not a journalist.

]]> By: Bas Timmers http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3355 Bas Timmers Fri, 09 Nov 2007 16:32:20 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3355 It's all about being trustworthy, isn't it? A lot of bloggers, say Cory Doctorow from BoingBoing or Jeff Jarvis, probably don't call themselves journalists (anymore). But I would consider them experts on their respective subjects. So whether you call someone a journalist or not, I don't care at all. We should call them experts, because visitors of their sites conceive them as such. It’s all about being trustworthy, isn’t it? A lot of bloggers, say Cory Doctorow from BoingBoing or Jeff Jarvis, probably don’t call themselves journalists (anymore). But I would consider them experts on their respective subjects. So whether you call someone a journalist or not, I don’t care at all. We should call them experts, because visitors of their sites conceive them as such.

]]> By: Dave http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3357 Dave Fri, 09 Nov 2007 15:35:39 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3357 Good point. Though I'd be interested to see those studies if you know any off the top of your head. I'd be especially interested to know how they got people towards that "finer analysis" — as in, to what extent could we expect people to make the same analysis and distinctions in their day-to-day media consumption habits? Good point. Though I’d be interested to see those studies if you know any off the top of your head. I’d be especially interested to know how they got people towards that “finer analysis” — as in, to what extent could we expect people to make the same analysis and distinctions in their day-to-day media consumption habits?

]]> By: Dave http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3358 Dave Fri, 09 Nov 2007 15:34:30 +0000 http://onlinejournalismblog.com/2007/11/09/why-does-it-matter-if-we-call-it-journalism/#comment-3358 Good point. Though I'd be interested to see those studies if you know any off the top of your head. I'd be especially interested to know how they got people towards that "finer analysis" — as in, to what extent could we expect people to make the same analysis and distinctions in their day-to-day media consumption habits? Good point. Though I’d be interested to see those studies if you know any off the top of your head. I’d be especially interested to know how they got people towards that “finer analysis” — as in, to what extent could we expect people to make the same analysis and distinctions in their day-to-day media consumption habits?

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